Yeah I can get behind the ‘everything included in the cost’ I just don’t think Wall spells are the right basis for determining a default for any create X.
I recently denied a spell one of my players built via the rules that came out to second level. It created shapeable, permanent, nondispellable walls that though wooden were as tough as stone. All legal by the book but I felt it frankly spit in the face of the end game and the implied setting to allow spells to do that (especially such a low level slot). If casters could do that then we’d have stone cities and castles everywhere in time.
I completely agree with your conclusion; if the math I’ve run had ended up with economically viable magical construction, I would have altered the assumptions until it was no longer economically viable. That spell your player designed may have followed the rules, but it would have led to inappropriate conclusions, which is one reason why I try to always make sure that these equations lead to a result that is generically (though not guaranteed) worse than simply hiring men to do the work.
I’m not certain that requiring 67 casts of a 4th-level spell is too strong, though. If you’re a 7th level caster, that would require you 67 days, and while you would save money on building your tower, you could simply have gone into town, hired yourself out, and made 325 gp per 4th level spell you cast. (Presumably you would also occasionally cast other levels of spells, making the difference even more.) So unless you’re out in the middle of nowhere and hiring people is literally not an option, there would be no reason to ever cast this Create Etc spell; it is both faster and cheaper to hire people to do it.
As a 14th level mage, the equation changes a little. 67 casts would take you only 17 days, so you would actually save time. (A 14th level mage armed with both this spell and wall of stone could create a tower from nothing for 0 GP in 17 days.) However, his opportunity cost would remain significant; casting 12 5th level spells and 67 4th level spells in the open market would gain him 36, 775 GP; he could hire men to build a tower and walk away with 21,000 GP in profit, taking only 14 days more than him casting the spells to do it himself. (Of course, this also assumes you can find buyers for your spells, which is not completely guaranteed, but if you’re in a Class 1 market which most 14th level characters should at least know how to get to it’s not a totally unreasonable assumption.)
But as I said, I didn’t put a lot of effort into balancing Create Etc, it’s entirely possible that 180 GP per cast is too much. In an actual campaign, I would certainly drop it down to at least 150 (to match Wall of Wood, which is the same level). I would also probably require it to be multiple different spells; one for furniture, one for decorations, one for floors and roofs, and so on.
I think that the viability of selling your magic is very case dependent. There isn’t a whole lot of use in town for Cone of Cold, for example, even in a size one market!
That said if a pc invested in a money-maker spell than yeah it would be better to hire people. And I totally agree that that should be the desired conclusion!
I think that the viability of selling your magic is very case dependent. There isn’t a whole lot of use in town for Cone of Cold, for example, even in a size one market!
That said if a pc invested in a money-maker spell than yeah it would be better to hire people. And I totally agree that that should be the desired conclusion!
Thanks! I try. There’s lots of secret math in ACKS. I have a huge spreadsheet called “Mathematics Behind the Scenes” where I try to track it all.
The only time where the math won’t add up is when I started with two different (usually inherited) sub-systems and they end up overlapping into each other. That leads to occasional wonkiness, but so far it’s pretty minor.